Chat Night Transcript From Sub Space and Sub Drop Talk

<~luna[KM]> Now I’d like to hear from everyone… have you experienced subspace? If you don’t know if you have, it’s okay.
<selene1123> i’m pretty new…so i think i have but am not sure
<slavelauren> i have
<radiogirl> I most definitely have
<pet_rain> i’m not sure  i think i would like a clear definition i’v heard different people desribe it differently
<selene1123> thank you pet_rain!  i am confused about some of the contradicting definitions
* ~luna[KM] smiles
<radiogirl> I think subspace would happen differently for each individual
<~luna[KM]> we will definitely be covering that
<slavelauren> i agree with that radiogirl
<~luna[KM]> I have experienced subspace as well, just so you all know where I’m coming from.
<pet_rain> yes everyone experiences everything differently
<~luna[KM]> welcome littlemiss96
<pet_rain> hi
<selene1123> hello
<slavelauren> hi littlemiss96
<littlemiss96> thanks…hi all
<~luna[KM]> we’ve just started talking about subspace and subdrop so jump right in when you feel comfortable.
<radiogirl> For me, subspace is also what I call my “happy place”
<~luna[KM]> are there other words for it?
<slavelauren> same for me
<~luna[KM]> euphoria?
<selene1123> i think that’s a good word for it
<radiogirl> yes, it is a euphoric place
<littlemiss96> i’m still really new to all this, but I think I got there last week…euphoria
<selene1123> like feeling the need to purr, lol
<~luna[KM]> it can also be a primal place
<radiogirl> but its where I am comfortable, secure in myself and my Master’s love
<~luna[KM]> one where you retreat to animal instincts
<radiogirl> yes
<radiogirl> that too
<radiogirl> :)
<slavelauren> so true
<~luna[KM]> So, as you can see sub space is a number of different things, but we can agree that it’s a happy euphoric sensation or ‘place’
<pet_rain> right like youve been redused down to your core and where you feel most content like there is nothing wrong in the world
<slavelauren> yes
<radiogirl> exactly
<selene1123> that perfect feeling
<slavelauren> oh yeah i like that
<pet_rain> okay then i’v experianced that i’v heard it defined very differently though
<radiogirl> so I have a question for you guys
<radiogirl> How do YOU get there?
<~luna[KM]> It’s different each and every time we play
<~luna[KM]> and I don’t get there everytime
<littlemiss96> sometimes its deeper than others
<selene1123> for me, it is through serving Master….even something as simple as dinner or desert
<radiogirl> yes of course littlemiss
<slavelauren> for me its the sound of Masters voice it doesnt matter if we are “playing” or not
<~luna[KM]> exactly, these are called triggers
<selene1123> i agree with you slavelauren
<selene1123> it is in or out of a schece
<slavelauren> we could be driving in His car
<selene1123> *scene
<radiogirl> it can be either for some people
<radiogirl> doesnt take a scene to put me in subspace
<pet_rain> when i’m laying in His lap or at his feet infrount of the couch or its after Hes played with me or used me, sometimes its after i’m punished sometimes just the looks He gives me
<slavelauren> We have a kinda trigger phase that puts me right under
<slavelauren> phrase sorry
<pet_rain> whats that?
<~luna[KM]> slavelauren, is the phrase something you can share with us?
<slavelauren> the simple words of To Serve Him is the greatest gift in Life
<slavelauren> sorry i had to ask
<pet_rain> dont be sorry
* ~luna[KM] smiles, that’s okay and I assumed so
<selene1123> understood
<slavelauren> thanks
<radiogirl> thank you slavelauren
<slavelauren> your welcome
<slavelauren> He says that and im under fast
<~luna[KM]> alright, so how would you describe YOUR subspace to someone who has never experienced it?
<selene1123> my subspace is a state of perfect harmony between Master and i
<slavelauren> wow thats hard, for me its like im there but not there.kinda outside looking in
<slavelauren> not feeling except ectasy
<~luna[KM]> For me, it is a sense of complete peace and happiness, but also a separation from my physical body (the pain if if it play) and a sort of spiritual connection to my Master.
<littlemiss96> the place where nothing else matters but my Master and me
<radiogirl> for me, its when I open myself totally to my Master
<selene1123> i have never felt a physical separation
<radiogirl> communion of souls
<selene1123> the opposite actually – i become very aware of my body and the sensations i feel
<radiogirl> some call the physical separation “flying”
<~luna[KM]> oh I have felt that way as well selene1123
<pet_rain> the only thing thats real is Him, His dominance is a weight i can really FEEL on me it engulfs me surrounds me consumes me and W/we are perfect there is no higher happieness there is nothing else that is real
<~luna[KM]> very beautiful pet_rain, lovely description
<slavelauren> im aware of the sensations but if it is pain or anything negative it does not hurt
<radiogirl> very nicely put pet
<slavelauren> wow pet thats awesome
<selene1123> i love the way you put that pet
<pet_rain> RIGHT i cant feel pain
<pet_rain> thanks
<littlemiss96>are all of you in 24/7 relationships?
<slavelauren> sometimes it gets me through some serious “play” Master is a bit heavy handed lol
<~luna[KM]> I generally can feel the pain, but it’s not painful.
<slavelauren> i am
<selene1123> yes littlemiss
<radiogirl> I am not
<littlemiss96> ok, thanks. i am not either
<~luna[KM]> You are LDR aren’t you radiogirl?
<pet_rain> i think the reason i can’t feel pain is because its negitive and to feel anything negitive would be selfish and i am incapable of being selfish there is only His pleasure
<radiogirl> for me its like…… I am so immersed in the pain that it ceases to exist…
* ~luna[KM] thinks pet_rain is a poet :)
<slavelauren> yes she is
<pet_rain> no i’m not
<pet_rain> (blushes)
<radiogirl> and I know that He immerses himself in it to
<slavelauren> well you are excellent with your words
<pet_rain> thank you
<selene1123> you have a gift for putting feelings into the perfect words
<radiogirl> yes I am in  a LDR, Luna
<slavelauren> radiogirl that is exactly the way Master describes His feelings when we talk about how He feels
<~luna[KM]> Did anyone read the optional pre-reading for tonight?
<radiogirl> yes
<slavelauren> i am sorry i did not
<pet_rain> i read some of it but most of it woulnd’t come up
<littlemiss96> i did
<radiogirl> i always do my homework Luna
<radiogirl> LOL
* ~luna[KM] winks… that’s why it is optional
<selene1123> i skimmed through it during work
<pet_rain> i only got to read about sub drop
<~luna[KM]> In the Mistress Steel essay, she talks about different levels of subspace
<~luna[KM]> and that you can move through the levels smoothly, like climbing a ladder
<pet_rain> yeah i would like to read that
<slavelauren> i have read it before and i its very well put for me
<~luna[KM]> well I can send you a copy pet_rain to your email if it won’t open. Just shoot me a message via the contact page when we are done here to remind me and give me your email.
<~luna[KM]> So, how important is sub space for you?
<selene1123> it is essential for me
<slavelauren> same for me
<radiogirl> same here
<selene1123> if i do not feel that space then i feel like i am not in harmony with Master
<~luna[KM]> I could actually take it or leave it. I love it when I experience it, don’t get me wrong, but it’s not important to my relationship or connection with Master.
<selene1123> and that is simply not an option for me
<slavelauren> very true
<littlemiss96> after hearing from all of you, i think my definition may have been too narrow
<slavelauren> what do you mean littlemiss96
<littlemiss96> well, i think i was thinking that subspace was only that detached euphoria, but listening to you guys, I am realizing that i go there whenever i talk to Master, whether in person, phone, or even text
<selene1123> that’s how i feel
<slavelauren> i can acheive it any time anywhere no matter what the form of communication is
<selene1123> or even when i am not with Master but doing something i know will please him in the future
<~luna[KM]> Not everyone you meet will agree with the definition that it’s a broader definition.
<slavelauren> very true luna
<~luna[KM]> Some will say that the non-play sub space isn’t sub space
<~luna[KM]> It’s more a slave space that is a focus for some relationships
<selene1123> that’s one of the reasons i was confused
<littlemiss96> ehhh..to each his/her own, i think
<slavelauren> for me it is slave space always
<~luna[KM]> Sure, the hope is that you will be able to develop your own definition.
<~luna[KM]> wb pet_rain
<pet_rain> oh i’m sorry it kicked me off
<pet_rain> my Master’s here now
<~luna[KM]> welcome pet_rain’s Master
<slavelauren> welcome Sir
<pet_rain> He’s reading along
<pet_rain> He said thanks
<radiogirl> Welcome Sir
<radiogirl> nice to have you with us
<selene1123> good evening
<~luna[KM]> Let’s focus now on play time
<~luna[KM]> how important is sub space to play time?
<slavelauren> pretty important for me
<selene1123> it depends on what kind of play for me
<selene1123> if it is physical/involves pain, very important
<slavelauren> very true
<littlemiss96> i dont think its possible for me to separate
<pet_rain> i think its very importain because i think i can please Him better while i’m in subspace
<radiogirl> I agree selene
<slavelauren> being in subspace expands my limits alot
<~luna[KM]> I agree with pet_rain that I’m more pliable when in subspace, Master can get me to do things that I would normally hesitate to do when I’m in subspace.
<selene1123> definitely
<radiogirl> Oh yes slavelauren
<radiogirl> thats when you learn how strong you actually are
<~luna[KM]> So, what if you can’t get to subspace? Are there alternatives to experiencing that ‘high’?
<slavelauren> well i dont know about everyone else but i am a slave so i dont have safewords or limits but subspace makes it easier sometimes
<pet_rain> right me too
<radiogirl> well, endorphins come
<radiogirl> and thats my High if i am not in subspace
<slavelauren> i always acheive subspace so i cant answer that
<littlemiss96> i think i do too, slavelauren
<~luna[KM]> I think a pretty darned good orgasm is a great alternative *grins*
<radiogirl> oh yeah luna
<littlemiss96> lol for sure
<selene1123> ditto, luna!
<slavelauren> true
<pet_rain> well… sometimes it doens’t come during sometimes i just feel used, but after its done i guess that feeling of being used and knowing that i made Him happy brings me to sub space
<~luna[KM]> how about emotional release. I know that sometimes when I play I feel emotions just pour out of me and that’s a healing process.
<slavelauren> one little problem with that luna i can only orgasm on command
<slavelauren> so if i dont have permission then that doesnt work for me
<~luna[KM]> sure, then that alternative isn’t good for you.
<slavelauren> for me its all about an emotional release
<pet_rain> i dont think i have emotional releases during play
<selene1123> it has almost nothing to do with physical release for me
<~luna[KM]> Does any of you cry during play/space?
<pet_rain> there is a emotional connetion sometimes
<pet_rain> yes
<pet_rain> i do
<pet_rain>  alot
<selene1123> i haven’t….yet
<radiogirl> oh yes
<littlemiss96> i haven’t yet, but I know I will
<~luna[KM]> How about laugh?
<selene1123> all the time….my Master loves “playful” play
<littlemiss96> oh yes…
<littlemiss96> we laugh togther a lot…and I’ve laughed in orgasm too
<slavelauren> i do both
<~luna[KM]> When I’ve entered space and the pain intensifies I tend to laugh when it hurts
<pet_rain> i’v laughed dureing play but when i’m in space i dont, i’ll smile alot but thats about it
<radiogirl> slavelauren, may I ask a question
<pet_rain> well sometimes i’ll like half laugh half cry its wierd
<littlemiss96> me too, pet_rain
<slavelauren> of course anything?
<radiogirl> how long have you been with your Master?
<radiogirl> im curious about the “come on command”
<slavelauren> over 5 years now
<slavelauren> cumming on command takes alot of practice and patience
<slavelauren> and trial and error
<pet_rain> i’m not allowed to cum without permission but i have trouble cumming on command
<radiogirl> I would like to talk with you about that sometime
<slavelauren> of course when we are finished i will give you my email and yahoo nic i am on alot
<radiogirl> I sent you a PM
<~luna[KM]> Are we ready to move on to Sub Drop?
<radiogirl> with my email
<slavelauren> i am allowed to talk to anyone
<pet_rain> yes
<selene1123> i think i experienced sub drop very badly this weekend
<~luna[KM]> wanna talk about it selene1123?
<littlemiss96> i had my first experience with it last week…awful
<~luna[KM]> I’d like to hear your experiences if you are willing to share them.
<slavelauren> got it radiogirl
<pet_rain> can someone define that for me?
<selene1123> to me, subspace is almost 24/7, but this weekend I completely threw out my neck….could not move, sit up, or talk…much less serve Master
<selene1123> all i wanted to do was cry
<~luna[KM]> Sub Drop is when the endorphins and euphoria leave your body and you feel what I call a crash in mood
<~luna[KM]> For some people this can be very severe and traumatic.
<selene1123> Master had to take care of me and i felt so….useless
<slavelauren> when i experience it is very traumatic
<pet_rain> okay like when you feel like yesterday you were His perfect little tng but today you feel frustrated and all wrong like that?
<~luna[KM]> I have felt that way too selene1123, when I’m sick.
<littlemiss96> i had a really rough time
<slavelauren> have you talk to Him about it?
<littlemiss96> combined with PMS…
<~luna[KM]> When I’m out of commission, he tells me that it’s his turn to take care of his property… his job ya know.
<selene1123> luna, that’s what my Master says….but i still feel so lost
<slavelauren> because Master has never experience subspace or sub drop He has asked me to discuss with Him the feeling that go with each one sub drop more bc He sees subspace in me most of the time
<slavelauren> smae here luna
<~luna[KM]> Did you know that sub drop happens more in committed relationships than in casual or long distance ones?
<selene1123> i can see that
<~luna[KM]> I did a non-academic study with the munch groups I attend and it was overwhelming
<slavelauren> i would have to agree with that
<pet_rain> i can deffently see how
<~luna[KM]> I know what I think as the reason, but why do you think that is the case?
<slavelauren> i think that is more of an emotional attachment in committed relationships
<selene1123> i think it is the level of devotion
<littlemiss96> i think that’s what partially caused mine…i’m realizing my heart is getting involved in this along with my mind and body
<pet_rain> because you are more emotionally connected with them everythings more real in your face everyday
<slavelauren> very tue luna
<slavelauren> true sorry
<~luna[KM]> I think that more casual or separate-lives relationships have less sub drop because of a defense mechanism to protect the person’s emotional state. When in a live-in relationship, you let your guard down more often, allowing for drop.
<littlemiss96> since my relationship is new, I kind of discounted that I would go through sub drop…i was totally unprepared for it
<slavelauren> very true luna
<~luna[KM]> Drop is the same though, the emotional distress, feelings of inadequacy or disbelief that you just went through play activity x, y and z. Or even shock from injuries received, and thoughts on how you can enjoy something like ‘that’.
<radiogirl> Its impossible to be prepared for subdrop
<littlemiss96> Master also had some personal stuff that kept him away from me for a couple of days, and I didn’t know why…in my fragile state, I began to have abandonment issues
<~luna[KM]> What forms of aftercare are available to you when you do drop?
<~luna[KM]> that can totally happen littlemiss96
<slavelauren> yes it can littlemiss
<selene1123> i feel the same way sometimes littlemiss
<littlemiss96> plus I was PMSing…so it was the perfect storm…lol
<slavelauren> Master is really big on aftercare
<radiogirl> lol
<littlemiss96> I talked to Master about it, and he apologized, and has promised to be there for more aftercare
<selene1123> i use my slave journal as aftercare; writing helps me “balance” myself out
<selene1123> plus i’m writing for Master so i feel connected to him
<slavelauren> when i first came to live with Master fulltime i already knew that He leaves every week Monday through Wednesday to see His sub about an hour from here but that first month was horrible abandonment issues galore
<littlemiss96> so do I selene1123…and I send it to Master
<slavelauren> i journal alot
<littlemiss96> i do ok as long as I know what’s going on and why he’s gone…when he says, “talk to you this afternoon” and then he doesn’t…that’s when I freak out
<~luna[KM]> I tend to find that taking a long hot bath or shower helps
<~luna[KM]> and chocolate, lots of chocolate
<littlemiss96> lol chocolate always works
<~luna[KM]> I’ve got some music I like to listen to as well when I’m dropping
<littlemiss96> or I love a day at the beach
<slavelauren> chocolate works very well
<~luna[KM]> Anything else you’d like to talk about related to sub drop?
<slavelauren> i have a meditaion cd that works really well bc it is all about sub drop and it guides you through getting out of it most of the time it works
<~luna[KM]> where did you get a CD like that slavelauren?
<littlemiss96> do y’all find it worse in connection to your cycle?
<selene1123> i’m interested too
<radiogirl> me 2
<littlemiss96> me too
<slavelauren> at a convention i attended a few years ago, i will true to download to mp3 and send it to everyone who would like it
<slavelauren> i have alot of them all different ones
<~luna[KM]> ooooh, that would be way cool! Can you legally share them?
<slavelauren> they help me alot
<radiogirl> I would love that
<slavelauren> i dont see why not
<selene1123> that would be great, slavelauren
<slavelauren> they are not copyrighted
<slavelauren> i just looked
<littlemiss96> should be legal then
<slavelauren> i like helping out anyone who asks especially if it helps them serve their Master better
<radiogirl> I appreciate that
<littlemiss96> thanks so much…should we pm you our email addresses?
<selene1123> thank you

When You Can’t Get Away: Follow Up to Submissive PMS

In a recent video post about Submissive PMS I had someone email me with some questions that I thought deserved a new post. If you haven’t seen the video or attached post, please go to the article and read it first!

Now on to his questions:

1. What’s a subbie to do when, for whatever reason, he or she cannot get away? What about the use of corporal discipline to help put the sub in his or her place?

Sure there will always be times when a submissive is not able to get away to refocus for a number of reasons. In this case, I am a firm believer of a mantra or meditation. It can be said aloud or internally no matter where you are. You may even be able to close your eyes and focus on your breathing to really center yourself. This works wonderfully if you only have a few moments in which to reset your mind and continue.

It will not work all the time; it’s just a matter of being human that sometimes for whatever reason, you are moody or grouchy and inheriently disobedient. When you realize this might be the case; informing your Dominant is the best course of action. Sure it could get you in trouble if you do disobey, but at least they will be equiped with some of the reason behind it.

Another way to try to refocus or at least not snap at your Dominant is the famous count to 5 trick. It really does work. I kinda like to count backward from 10. I feel centered and focused when through that bit of meditation.

About corporal punishment… it’s an okay idea, but then that puts the responsibility into the Dominant’s hand to try to correct your own problem of lack of focus. What is really going on when this happens is the Dominant is facilitating your need to refocus with a meditation or other separation from the event by giving you pain to do so. In essense the Dominant is creating the recentering time you need.  I’d like to focus in this blog about how we can help ourselves become better human beings that happen to be submissive and ‘making’ the Dominant correct our mood is in that vein.

The other concern is that it doesn’t work all the time. What if your mood is just so off kilter that your act worse after the punishment. In this case the Dominants attempt at correction pushed your further away from center and you will most likely find it harder to refocus after that. It becomes a steep downward slope.

2. I have a feeling that, unless they enjoy feminization, male subs might not exactly take ownership of the term submissive PMS. Any ideas on a term for males? It might not be as cute, but something like “sub glitch”?

Oh I’m sure we can come up with a term that male submissives could embrace that means the same thing. So, dear reader, what ideas do you have to replace PMS with something more masculine centric? I’d love to see what you come up with in the comments!

Submissive PMS and How to Deal With It

This video post is about how to deal with a submissive bout of PMS.

It’s not your normal run of the mill PMS. You don’t have cramps or bloating or headaches or chills, but your mood is so out of whack that you are getting in trouble just by opening your mouth. You don’t know where your submissive filter went, all you know is that it’s gone and you’re going to be paying for it with every utterance. This is submissive PMS. I suffer from it often and it’s something I’ve learned a few things from to make it easier to get through. Let’s help you out.

What’s the Big Deal?

I’m pretty certain most of you haven’t heard this term before and that’s because I just made it up. You won’t find submissive PMS in any dictionary (urban, BDSM or otherwise), but if you have been submissive for more than a few minutes you know exactly how I’m going to describe it. It starts with the sudden urge to just tell your Dominant to ‘go get it yourself!’ It can lead to mouthing off, acting pissy when there is no real reason behind and when confronted you can’t explain why you are feeling that way in the first place.

Confront It Dead On

A lot of times it’s obvious that you are entering sub PMS and you can work to stop it before it gets your butt in their sling. The moment you notice the ‘get it yourselfs’ creeping into your head, ask to remove yourself from the room or their presence and go refocus. If this means reading or blogging or meditating then go do it. I tend to get my catharsis from blogging but each person is going to find a different way to refocus. If you can identify an underlying thought or problem that caused the PMS you will want to talk to your Dominant about it. Never harbor feelings from your Dominant, even if you think they are trivial. It will help them help you. Win win in any case.

Apologize

After you have refocused, apologize to your Dominant for your slip in behavior or manners. They may not have even noticed it, but that’s not the purpose. The purpose is to make a mental note for you that you have corrected the behavior and are ready to continue serving. An apology is quite beneficial for that.

Resolve

You can’t prevent submissive PMS, but you can resolve to keep it in check. Make it a task to notice it before anyone else and correct it silently. Everyone has bad moods and off days, but our job as submissives and slaves is to make sure it doesn’t cloud our service. This of course is the hardest part. I’m still not there personally. I can’t recognize it sometimes and leave it to my Master noticing and correcting for me; usually not the way I wish it could be handled. Discipline yourself to make sure you can catch your backsliding and keep your backside from catching it for you.